Well, well, well.  Look who it is.  Yes, it’s our former assistant, Trevor Finn, who has made the leap from script-collator/lunch-getter/baboon-anal-gland-drainer to Story Editor on XIII: The Series. Congratulations are in order and, as is customary whenever someone you once hired takes a step up in the industry, I’m anxiously awaiting the arrival of my “Thanks for hiring me that one time because it was a crucial step in the process that led to my inevitable succes” gift.

Impressive, no?  Our boy has come a long way from the days we used to make him eat balsa wood and old gum wrappers for lunch and laughs he would coordinate our scripts.  Of course, I’m not surprised. My fellow producers, Alex and Paul, now THEY are surprised (“Are you sure we’re talking about the same Trevor?  Trevor Finn?”), but I’m not because I know Trevor is a terrific writer.  How do I know?  Why, I’ve read his stuff.  Not lately mind you even though I told him I would get around to reading that revised script only to keep getting waylaid by miniseries work, horror script rewrites, new series idea spinning, and meetings.  BUT I HAVE read his stuff and it’s good.  How good?  So good that I’m going to read that revised script of his tonight for fear that he may someday be running his own show and fail to give me a job on the grounds that he never got around to reading MY script.

Continuing our trip down Stargate memory lane, let’s reflect back on a couple of episodes of Atlantis’s second season.  Namely…


Hey!  It’s a pre-Jennifer Keller Jewel Staite.  Well, you could be forgiven for failing to recognize her under that make-up.  Yes, before she was Atlantis’ Chief Medical Officer, Jewel played the role of the tragic young wraith, Ellia.  She was great – and that says a lot about how incredibly talented she is because she was required to convey a wide range of emotions through those prosthetics.  The fact that she was an utter professional and sweetheart certainly impressed as well. So, when an opportunity to cast a new recurring character presented itself, Jewel seemed like the obvious fit.  And it certainly helped that she’d been unrecognizable under the wraith mask.

Ellia is by no means evil and yet she must kill in order to survive. Having her drink the retrovirus and transform into a crazed mutant version of her hybrid self allows our team off the hook.  By episode’s end, they have to kill her.  But, what if she hadn’t mutated?  What if she had remained the original, divided Ellia?  What would the team have done then?  I would have loved to see that difficult dilemma play out.

This episode opened up a host of possibilities that we never really got around to pursuing – namely, the notion of wraith children.  In fact, I ended up pitching out a story involving Sheppard and co. teaming with the Genii to destroy a high value target that – surprise! – turns out to be a wraith nursery.  Talk about difficult dilemmas.  Anyway, I outlined the original story (along with three other Atlantis stories I missed out on) here: January 11, 2009: The 4 Best Stargate: Atlantis Episodes I Never Got to Write


The events of the last episode pay off in this one.  Carry-over!  I love it!  As the retrovirus Ellia transferred to Sheppard courses through his system, John becomes a superman – of sorts.  He’s fast, agile, strong – and suddenly possessed of a positively savage attitude.  One of the episode’s most interesting moments sees Sheppard sparring with Teyla.  Things get a little out of hand and, the next thing you know, he’s kissing her.  She lets him down – painfully.  Now, the question arises: Did the retrovirus make him act instinctually and wholly out of character or did it strip him of his inhibitions and lead him to act on some deep-seeded yearning?  In other words: Sheyla or not?

Personally, I always thought there was great potential there and even the suggestion of romantic feelings.  Although never pursued, it was always a possibility – until the Rachel Luttrell, the actress who played Teyla, became pregnant.  At that point, we were faced with several creative avenues, one of which involved making John the father.  And, while it certainly would have made for some fine drama, the prospect of a secret affair would, it was argued, undermine both characters.  But more on that topic when we hit season 4.

Anyway, the John/Teyla kiss was actually Rachel’s first onscreen kiss. And it just happened to come on a day when her parents were visiting the set.  Talk about pressure!

Love the egg hunt in the cave scenes but these type of sequences always bring to mind the gain/loss calculator.  The first team to visit the cave risks their lives to save Sheppard.  Two marines die in the process.  At episode’s end, we all breathe a sigh of relief and things are back to normal.  Except for our two marines.  Granted, we never really knew them but, presumably, other people did.  Say, their loved ones?

Sure, members of the expedition died all the time over the course of the series run, but there’s a difference between dying in the heat of battle and dying in an attempt to save someone else – in this case, a single individual.  I’m not arguing against the decision to risk their lives for Sheppard (We don’t leave our people behind, after all), only pointing out the apparent egocentricity of our top tier team members. To be fair, A LOT of shows (and movies) are guilty of this.  Thoughts?

31 thoughts on “June 29, 2012: Days of Stargate: Atlantis Past! Instinct! Conversion!

  1. Came by once again. This time to say: LOVE YOUR BLOG!!

    Amazing behind the scenes look.

    Love your work!!

  2. I recognized Jewel! It was her voice and her poise. She is such a cutie. I enjoyed that episode but it was a hard to watch the character struggle with her own nature. Tragic……. and it would have been an interesting twist if the serum had worked. Was that where you got Michael’s storyline?

    Conversion: I’ll have to re-watch it again. In life, you meet someone and make some kind of connection. Nothing ever comes of it but it’s in the back of your mind…… The path not taken and all that. You sure started something with that kissing scene. How many people still think they would end of together?

    The first few SGA books were very good but the ones after the show ended pursued a John/Teyla storyline. http://www.amazon.com/Stargate-Atlantis-Homecoming-SGA-16-Legacy/dp/1905586507/ref=sr_1_2?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1341016888&sr=1-2&keywords=stargate+atlantis
    I never liked them as a couple, so I couldn’t read the Legacy series after I tried the first one. It just seemed wrong to take the story and change it. Your (and Mr. Carl’s) ending for the series was much better too. I’m not sucking up, your ending had twists/turns I didn’t expect. It would have been a pleasure to watch.

    Oh, thanks for sharing the story about Rachel Luttrell’s parents. At least it wasn’t an in-depth sex scene. I’m not sure how actors or their families watch that. Especially spouses! In interviews they all say it’s not a big deal but it would be to me. How many co-stars end up in affairs?

    Congrats to Mr. Flinn! It’s always good to see a deserving person succeed.

    Das: I thought you meant that he was less eccentric. He’s still eccentric but he caught a few curveballs in this one. I love how everyone is in fear of him. He’s like a white tiger loose in a rabbit farm. Or maybe like someone that is just on this side of sanity and everyone senses it. Darn, I’ll have to read the series over now!

  3. Congrats to Trevor!! I always enjoyed seeing Jewel Staite, and the makeup on her in this episode was great, kudos to the make up dept, did not recognize her. Sheppard had his share of wraith like qualities, the iratis(sp) bug and Ellia germs. Great casting and makeup, I miss these shows.

  4. Those episodes were pretty good. I had to rewatch Instinct though when I found out Jewel had played Ellia. The makeup was that good.

    Take care and have a great night!!!
    Lisa R

  5. Instinct was a sad episode, I felt bad for Ellia as she really wanted to change. For the sake of my enjoyment of the show, I wish you would have kept her as a character (never appreciated Keller, but that’s another story entirely). Jewel did an excellent job here. I’m sure Ronon would have no qualms about eliminating the Wraith children, but the rest of the expedition would have had a harder time. Would have been interesting.

    I love Conversion, although I never could figure out why the Sheylas took that kiss as romantic, it was a violent assault in my eyes. I’m thinking that there was an underlying attraction there though and I’m not sure why you creative writer types couldn’t have come up with something other than a secret affair to make John Torren’s father. Ancient tech anybody? Or even have Teyla be pregnant with some alien life form and leave John and any other human out of it altogether. I would have liked it if, in the end, John and Teyla could have been together. After all you gave Rodney and Ronon someone.
    Joe F was great as he turned bug-like. Those scenes in his room where he’s hiding in the shadow are so poignant. And Elizabeth really doesn’t have a very good bedside manner, does she? But she tried.

    I think Red Shirts are just facts of life in dramas or sci-fi/fantasy. Wonder if those two guys liked bacon too?

  6. The above is not to say, however, that I wouldn’t have appreciated it MORE if you would have had Rodney and John end up together! Would have done wonders for my McSheppy soul. Seriously, would the writers have done something like this (pair two male lead s or semi – lead characters) if there weren’t objections (network? studio?) to the scenario?

  7. Instinct is not one of my favorites, though I’ve no complaints about the quality of acting. And the storyline was a nice moral delimna. and while worrying about ethics, what about a Wraith who worked so hard to assist his fellow Wraith, despite the fact her feelings about him were conflicted at best? I know, he was just another baddie to kill. but I’m suprised Das hasn’t piped up at the injustice of callously shooting him. After all, he did maintain close to a starvation diet, though he could easily have fed more often on the cattl…um people on the planet. Not like they were any match for him, especially if he used some Wraith mind messing powers.
    Conversion was a bit more to my taste. Loved Sheppard’s reveling in his sudden ability to outrace and outlast Ronan. Reminded me a bit of the SG1 episode with the bracelets conveying super powers. I could imagine some general or biology geek back on Earth just trying to figure a way to create more Bug Sheppards. As for the Marines being killed, well, first off that’s a risk the job comes for. And I would expect such a mission was a volunteer basis, with they being only the lucky ones to win a slot on the team. While it’s a shame no one thought of sending Sheppard in before they died, the fact is people die all the time, and often for bad reasons or no reasons at all. Had it been one of the nameless Marines infected, a similiar mission no doubt would still have been undertaken in they type of universe Atlantis was set in. After all, the only reason you used Sheppard was to ramp up the emotional investment of the viewers, no? The script would still have worked using one of them, but without some backstory we the viewers would have had one less hook to hold us to the story.
    ah well, doggie demanding belly rub time, and who am I to deprive her? Hope the weekend finds you having a great time, and not suffering the lamp pole melting temps we are “enjoying” here on the east coast.

  8. I loved Instinct. I thought it was an amazing episode. Jewel was fantastic of course. She really showed her stuff here. I loved this one because it was what I felt was a Shakespearean tragedy from beginning to end. The relationship built from the father finding the young wraith was doomed from the start. They did love each other and they were willing to sacrifice as well. There was never going to be a good ending.

    I always like a good hurt Shep episode, but what makes this even better is we see a dark Shep. I felt that we were seeing a lot of Shep desire here. He’s got a desire for Teyla that he’d normally keep to himself. Even if it was just a temporary desire, he would never act on it in normal circumstances. He’s got a desire to walk a darker edge, but in normal circumstances he’d be more restrained. I felt that this affected him in such a way that his tendencies are coming out. There is a lot of pain for him here as well, IMO.

    What wasn’t mentioned here is the moves that Caldwell is trying to make on Shep’s command. Knowing the episodes that’s coming, I’ve speculated that perhaps right before this episode is when Caldwell gets a G’oauld implanted in him. It would explain his actions. Anyone else consider this?

    These are great episodes. You all really delivered the goods.

  9. you know… I’ve always had a bit of bone to pick with the “continuity” of these 2 episodes..?

    As in at the end of 107, Shep isn’t all that injured, and didn’t Carson get whacked on the head? Yet, at the beginning of 108, Shep is wheeled into the Infirmary being greeted by Carson who’s now *in his Scrubs* looking all healthy, ecetera… and oh BTW, shouldn’t they have ALL [after a *long* walk!] been on the SAME Jumper through a SpaceGate..? — I dunno, the “timing” of stuff just seemed all off… Really, how long does it take to get gurneyed from the Jumper Bay, so Carson can shower & change?

    just saying…

  10. Both of these episodes are rank among my favorites! Elia’s story is so completely and perfectly tragic and raises so many questions and Jewel Staite plays the role of a lost and confused young woman (-ish) wonderfully. What might have been possible if the retrovirus worked on her, a wraith queen? Could she have formed the basis of something like the Tok’ra for wraith?

  11. I thought Instinct and Conversion were great episodes! Ronon showed off his tracking skills in Instinct. “One wraith in the forrest. I’ll be done before morning.” For me, this episode was horrific, curious, surprising, sad, with a tragic ending. The towns people taking shovels and pitch forks to kill off any alive wraith was necessary but horrific. How Ellia was raised was very interesting, especially finding out her “father” let her feed on him. And who he was the son of was dramatic. Young Ellia trying to control her instincts and wanting to be normal yet having to be violently killed in the end was tragic. Teyla teaching Ronon when to obey Sheppard’s orders and when not to was fun. By the way, what is with McKay and children. Why are they so drawn to him. He may be mister smarty pants but maybe they see a vulnerable innocence in him, a child-like persona. Interesting.

    Continuing the story with Conversion was great. Watching Sheppard mutate was interesting. I don’t think Sheppard was himself when he kissed Teyla. He was something else, darker, uncontrolled. The cave scenes were scarey. Those bugs were awesome. Joe if you are concerned why the marines died, then why did you kill them off? Why didn’t they just get hurt and the others had a huge fight on their hands while dragging them out of the cave and getting them back to Atlantis for help. The pen is in your hand, my friend. They don’t always have to die, do they?

  12. Oh and congratulations Trevor! Good to see you learned something while working for Joe. Maybe one day you will realize what it was. How is little Eufemia? (or whatever that poor little baby girl’s name is Joe forced you to use or be fired)

  13. i’m excited for comic con. Have you researched any restaurants so far? I’m gonna try to check out brooklyn girl eatery and cafe chloe while i’m there

  14. only pointing out the apparent egocentricity of our top tier team members. To be fair, A LOT of shows (and movies) are guilty of this. Thoughts?

    Well, that’s just the curse of the redshirts, isn’t it? Given such circumstances, people are expected to die, but it can never (or very rarely) be the main characters. In the end, they are just plot devices.

    That said, I was recently thinking how interesting it would be if sci-fi shows occasionally showed the B shift. Surely someone competent is running the ship while the captain sleeps, right? It’s not just random science officers puttering away and then suddenly the enemy appears onscreen and they call the captain. It doesn’t work that way in the real military, so why should it in sci-fi military? An episode where the B shift actually saves the day in a way that shows they’re capable and where the entire main cast sits out would be extremely rewarding for those of us who do pause to think about the poor redshirts. (The same goes for any number of non sci-fi shows, too. I mean, is there really only one BAU team for all of the US? I realize that there’s not that many serial killers, but watching Criminal Minds, you’d think 1 of 10 people were, and thus there would need to be more than seven profilers in that entire unit. But that’s the nature of serialized TV, of course.)

  15. The death of the marines, or any other “redshirts” in tv shows or movies, sometimes bothers me. Actually, it’s not the deaths that bother me–I understand that real life soldiers and police and others risk their lives everyday, and often get killed. I understand that in fictional life, the number of deaths are increased to up the tension and point out the danger. It’s the reaction of the main characters, and me as a viewer, that sometimes bothers me.

    If no main character gets killed, everyone is happy and relieved at the end, maybe even cracking jokes and planning the next adventure. Again, I understand the reason for this since it would completely change the tone of the show if every death acknowledged an emotional impact. Still, in some cases the lack of emotional response from the main characters makes them seem heartless and callous, and then I feel heartless and callous because I don’t really care about the deaths either.

    Most of the time if I’m watching a show I can ignore these qualms and just enjoy the adventure, but sometimes I can’t. I have a feeling that the times I can’t turn off the nagging worry are times when the ending seems too “happy” for the main characters, but I’d have to go back and rewatch to figure out for sure why some shows bother me and others don’t. (And I’m talking about all shows here, not just SGA.)

    How often do these kind of questions come up in the writer’s room? What kind of reasoning/thinking goes into deciding how the main characters react?

  16. Dead henchmen… deleted scene from Austin Powers shows the family of the henchman who was run over by the steam roller being notified of their husband/father’s death. Whenever I see a redshirt die, I immediately think “dead henchman”. Funny/not so funny.

  17. Loved Instinct! Loved Conversion! 🙂 Two awesome episodes! Great writing with plenty of action! 😀

    Conversion…though…has a special place in my heart as I am Shep Whumper. Just watching John go dark and transforming into a creature was l kinda like a guilty pleasure. 😉 I thought Joe (Flanigan) did an excellent job in going there and not make it too over-the-top. 🙂

  18. This was a case of risking, not sacrificing. In the Star Trek: Enterprise episode Similitude, we saw the crew make the decision to downright sacrifice Trip’s sentient clone for Trip’s life even over the clone’s objections. They were sure they needed the real Trip even though “Sim” had his memories. There was no question: it was a straight one-to-one sacrifice. And we spent the whole episode getting to know Sim so they went all out on a brave, dark storyline.

  19. @ SiSi – I dislike the death of main characters very much. I prefer the use of ‘red shirts’. Mainly it’s because I watch tv, movies, and read books as an escape from reality. Since the beginning of the year death has touched me, my family, and my friends at least a dozen times, with the majority happening since Easter. These weren’t just ‘acquaintences’, but family members, friends, and people from the community that we cared about. I haven’t talked about it here because…well…after a bit you just don’t want to hear sympathetic words anymore. You just want to forget. Perhaps that’s why characters in these shows don’t become overly emotional when someone dies…they, too, are numb. I think you have to stop feeling in order to endure.

    That said, I actually feel more emotion now when someone dies in FICTION. Just finished my friend’s book, and the last few pages are pretty intense. I cried my eyes out, struggling through the last few paragraphs and cursing myself for being such a big baby. In real life? In real life I do my best not to cry. I’ll tear up, sure, but I can pretty much suppress my deeper emotions…unless it’s a pet. I cry like a baby when a pet dies, too. But for some reason I become more emotionally distant when a person dies. Granted, I still have my husband, parents, and siblings, so no telling how I’ll react when I lose them, but for now I seem to only get emotional over the deaths of make-believe people, and animals. A psychologist would have a heyday with me. 😛

    So, anyways…I don’t like when main characters are killed off in my fictional stories. Sure, once in a while I can deal with it, and in some cases I know it’s necessary to move the story along. But sometimes it just feels like characters are killed off because the writers/creators are bored with them, or because they’re using the death just for an emotional response alone, much like gratuitous sex is used simply to titillate. When too many characters are killed off I find it often ruins the entire show/movie/story/franchise for me. For instance, I loved the first Pirates of the Caribbean movie. It was so much fun, and it made me exceedingly happy. Over the course of the movies that followed, however, many of the main and secondary characters from the first movie were killed off. It nearly ruined the first movie for me because when I would watch it, I couldn’t enjoy the characters as much knowing that they were going to die in one of the sequels. The deaths just put a damper on everything. I think when dealing with make-believe there’s nothing wrong with making believe that life does NOT have to reflect reality.

    Oddly enough, deaths in books don’t affect me quite as much, though I would hate to see the main character killed off, especially if it’s just to introduce someone new. However, in some unique cases I realize the death is absolutely necessary…even though I still gripe to Michael Moorcock about it. 😉


  20. Not sure if you’ve heard of this but there’s a videogame made by Studio Ghibli and Level 5 called Ni no Kuni: Wrath of the White Witch that looks absolutely beautiful coming out early Jan 2013 on the Playstation 3 Joe, as someone who likes anime you may be interested, and you’re not too old for games lol.

    Decent trailer here. You can see the Studio Ghibli touch.

  21. “Redshirts” are a fact of the genre. Somebody had to be wraith fodder (or whatever alien/monster is the villain), and no one wants it to be their “heroes”.

    Yes, I’m back from eating my way through Colorado and New Mexico. Those are a couple of places you need to put on the list for your foodie tour of the U.S.

    Nice to see Trevor again, and hear he’s surviving without your nurturing, guiding input.

  22. Just a call out to all of Joey’s east coast buddies – hope everyone is okay!

    We had a severe storm system pass through last night (between 1 am and 3 am here). Although here at the tippy tip of Jersey we are okay, I’m learning that other parts of the state, as well as parts of Delaware, MD (1 dead), PA, Ohio (1 dead), and Virginia (6 dead), didn’t do so well. Two cousins – 2 and 7 years old – were killed about 50 miles as the crow flies north of here in a NJ state park when a tree fell on their family tent. My in-laws (near Atlantic City) have no power, and they said it looks like a tornado went through the county (which has declared a state of emergency). We were very fortunate here. Storms often dissipate as they approach the very southern part of the state, and I think the Delaware Bay plays a part in this. We had some strong winds, some rain, some thunder and lightning, and the power flickered on and off about a dozen times, but that was it. We also had a thunderstorm yesterday morning that was actually worse for us lightning-wise, but it didn’t do any damage. The one last night was much different, and much more deadly. So, just hoping East Coasters are safe and sound, and not suffering too much damage from this storm.


    1. @das: I heard about that storm. Glad you all are okay. We used to live in SC, but now live in Alabama. We have friends and family though up and down the East Coast. (CT, RI, MA, PA, MD, VA, SC, and FL)

      Lisa R

  23. Hm, yes, redshirts. Yes, the he’s-dead-shrug-oh-well treatment bugs me, mostly because it contrasts so strongly against everyone’s angsty passion when we’re about to lose/do lose someone whose name was in the credits. Carson’s funeral was the most galling example. So, they go through all that whenever someone dies? Right…

    Gotta say, it’s odd to see you writing this. I mean, SG did this all the time. Did y’all ever discuss trying something different?

  24. Two of my favourite episodes, and while I agree that Jewel was great in Instinct, she just didn’t do it for me as Keller. A chief medical officer is supposed to command a sense of authority – like Carson. Keller was just too…wussy. Weir was a strong woman, as was Teyla, but Keller – she was too sweet, too jokey. Sorry, but for me the last series was wasted by far too many Keller centric episodes.

    As to your question, if Sheppard had been there on the first occasion there is no way he would have allowed his men to die in order to get him a cure. And I believe their deaths should have been addressed by him in some way at the end.

    And I for one am sorry that there wasn’t a development of that kiss. Even a subsequent break up would have added a rather tasty edge to the show. Never mind, some things weren’t meant to be…

  25. Hi Mr M!

    *coughs out the mothballs* Have been catching up on the blog.

    Congrats to Trevor! And with a surname Finn I assume he has Irish connections?

    I loved Instinct. I viewed this ep also as a dilemma/heartbreak for the Dad? He did everything to protect his daughter.

    “Redshirts” are indeed a way out for “loss”. There must be some material loss to underline the danger – otherwise it turns into The A-Team.

    SG did loss very well. (I’m thinking of “Heroes” particularly) And certainly the loss of Ford and Beckett underlined this in SGA.

    The loss of redshirts in general can be empty. It’s hard to get the balance right. In the case of Instinct I agree that I felt it a little hollow that 2 marines were killed for the sake of one.

    Loving the ep reviews.

    Best to one and all.


  26. *waves at Shirt’n’Tie!* Good to see you, and hope all is well!

    @ lisarrrr – The storm caused damage from Indiana to New Jersey – 13 dead now (most in VA). Our area is fine, just a few leaves on the ground, that’s all. But I was looking at pictures of the damage throughout the rest of southern NJ and it’s far worse than Hurricane Irene last year (the wind damage, that is – Irene caused a lot of flooding and many lives were lost as a result). My in-laws have no power or land-line phone (last I spoke with them), and may not have it back for a couple days. Radio stations are down. Grocery stores and restaurants have no power, so there’s going to be lots of spoiled food. And that also means a lot of lost revenue during the busy tourist season and just days before the 4th of July. It’s really a mess. Several family and friends in Atlantic Co. have trees down, many either on their houses or on their cars. I think the wind/tree damage is especially bad because we had such a mild winter and a decent amount of rain this spring, so the foliage has been especially dense the year. I’m glad that our area got off easy, but I certainly feel for those who are dealing with the damage from this storm.


    1. @das: My BIL lives in MD, and he emailed my husband this morning. They haven’t lost power, but the biggest town they’re closest to (Rockville) has no stop lights, I’m sorry to hear about all the damage.

      Lisa R

  27. Sure, members of the expedition died all the time over the course of the series run, but there’s a difference between dying in the heat of battle and dying in an attempt to save someone else – in this case, a single individual. (snip!) To be fair, A LOT of shows (and movies) are guilty of this. Thoughts?

    Belated response!

    ‘Red Shirts’… Agreed, most action/adventure shows do this all the time, but I have to admit you guys occasionally turned the stereotype on its head. I’m thinking specifically of ‘Heroes’ (SG1) and ‘Sunday’ (SGA). Red Shirts are in danger and it’s the main character’s who risk their lives and pay the ultimate price. Correction: popular recurring characters. (Daniel in ‘Meridian’ could maybe fit here…) Now. making the ‘red shirt’ the hero of an episode is even rarer! …Lt. Elliot in ‘Last Stand’ (SG1 season 5) is the only one I can think of off hand. You guys missed the boat by making that an implied ending. At least the emotions at the end of the episode recognized what Elliot was doing – SG1 was conflicted and hurt by the necessity – but I wanted more.

    Side note: I always wanted another episode featuring SG13 from ‘Heroes’! Man did you all give us some great three dimensional characters in a very short time. I think you tried the same thing with the all female team in SGA ‘Whispers’ but, IMHO, is didn’t work nearly as well – maybe because we never saw them on their own as a unit.

    Ah well, back to the lurker shadows!

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